Robert Leonard  00:59

For those listening that may not know who you are, walk us through your story and how you got to where you are today.

Travis Watts  01:05

Oh, man! That’s about a 30-minute story, but let’s cut that down to maybe 5 minutes.

I started as just a W2 employee. I did not know what I wanted to do. None of my jobs ever really resonated, and I was never passionate about them. I didn’t find them very fulfilling. I knew, long term, I wasn’t going to last in the corporate world. So, I picked up real estate investing in 2009. I started by buying a single-family home that I personally lived in. I got some government tax credits, house-hacked that with some roommates, and started realizing the power of passive income and cash flow. That really inspired me to get the ball rolling and take [passive income] a lot more seriously.

Back in 2009, I really didn’t know what I didn’t know. I didn’t have a big network. I hadn’t read a ton of books or anything on the subject of real estate. I did some fix-and-flips, buy and hold, and vacation rentals. I had my hands on a lot of single-family activity that was fully active and taking up a lot of my time. During this process, I actually took on a W2 job, working 100-hour workweeks in the oil industry. This often resulted in being away from home for long periods, and I just realized that’s not gonna be sustainable as a real estate strategy and career, for that matter. The more active I got, and the more properties I got under my belt, the more I just got frustrated, overwhelmed, and stressed out.

Around 2015, I did some soul-searching. I went back to the drawing board, and thought, “Man, I’ve got to be passive. If that means giving up real estate altogether or going into REITs or the stock market, that’s what it means. I just have to find a way to get hands-off because it’s killing me.” Then I found out about real estate syndications; a bunch of investors pooling money together to buy larger assets for sustainable, predictable cash flow. That literally changed my life. I liquidated my entire single-family portfolio. I completely shifted over to syndication investing; specifically, for passive income, to be hands-off.

Nowadays, I’m a full-time limited partner syndication investor in different types of deals. That brings us to today.

Robert Leonard  03:38

Before we dive into what you’re doing to invest passively, I want to talk a little bit more about your days as an active investor. Talk to us a bit more about those specific details. What did that journey look like? What were you doing to acquire properties, and what did your portfolio look like?

Travis Watts  03:51

First of all, I’ve been working since I was 15 years old. I’ve always been a good budgeter. I always saved a lot of money. Very diligent, I always kept a little tracker of where things are; income in, and expenses out. In addition to that, my parents had done everything they could to save for college.

They really wanted me to go to college, but I didn’t want to go to college. I ended up getting a scholarship to attend at least the first two years. I dedicated to that. “Fine. It’s basically free college. I’ll try it.” I pocketed that little chunk of money, in addition. All I could handle was two years. It just wasn’t for me. I knew it wasn’t for me in the beginning, but I had to go through the motions.

I took my savings, and I took that little nest egg, and that became my down payment for my very first single-family home. We’re talking about $20,000 in total. That was a down payment. I got an $8,000 government tax credit to purchase my first home. That was back in 2009, with the collapse and incentives to get people to buy homes. From there, it was all experimenting, and I had no game plan. I didn’t know what I was doing. I just knew that one day, I wanted enough passive income to take over my lifestyle expenses so I could be “financially free.” I didn’t know how to get there, but that’s how I started.

Robert Leonard  05:09

Were you buying only single-family properties?

Travis Watts  05:12

Yeah. When I say single-family, just to clarify, I had a combination of condos, townhomes, and single-family dwellings independently outside of an HOA and that kind of thing. So yes, at the time, 2009 through 2015, yes.

Robert Leonard  05:27

And were these all local properties to you?

Travis Watts  05:30

Yeah, that’s the other thing. I grew up in Fort Collins, Colorado, home to Colorado State University, so the first few properties were in the area. I had a lot of students that were renting with me and from me. Then I ended up going up and down the front range of Colorado. So if any of your listeners are familiar, that’s everywhere around Commerce City, Henderson, Brighton, and Denver. They were all in Colorado.

Robert Leonard  05:56

Did you ever do any multi-family before you got into passive? Or was everything single-family?

Travis Watts  06:03

Everything was single-family. Logically, [multi-family] would have been my next step had I not transitioned to syndications and learned about that avenue. I probably would have said, “I’m going to start doing like a duplex, then upgrade to a quad, then an 8-unit, 12-unit, and 30-unit.” I probably would have gone down that path, but no, I never did it.

Robert Leonard  06:24

How many single-families did you get under your belt before you decided to go passive?

Travis Watts  06:29

That’s a good question. I actually don’t know the answer to that as far as a total number because, as I said, I had different strategies going on for about 2 years. Some were a lot shorter term; just buy, fix up, and sell. Others were holds for anywhere from 1-year to 3-year vacation rentals. Just to give you a ballpark number, I had somewhere around 6-7 properties at any given time as I was trying to actively manage the portfolio. Even at that stage, I didn’t see how I was going to double that. For example, with ambitions to go for 50 or 100 properties, I could see no conceivable way of doing that.

Robert Leonard  07:07

What does your portfolio look like today? Albeit, just a small piece of each property you own as an LP. But what are those properties that you’re investing in? What do those look like?

Travis Watts  07:18

The majority of my portfolio is in value-add multifamily syndication. We’re talking about 200-  to 600-unit apartment buildings where I’m a co-owner. I may be a 1-3% owner on a project. I’ve done 26 as of today, as a limited partner. I also dedicate about 20% of my portfolio to other types of passive investments outside of real estate. They’re kind of in the same syndication model, though, so I don’t know how many of those are. A few.

Robert Leonard  07:51

What do those look like? What other types of syndication models are out there other than real estate?

Travis Watts  07:56

Syndication really is just the pooling of money from multiple individuals to buy something or to do something with that money, so that one person doesn’t have to come up with millions of dollars out of their own pocket.

Other types of investments that I invest in for monthly passive cash flow are ATM investing, note lending, note investing, distressed debt investing, and things like that. I’m cash-flow focused, and I focus primarily on things that distribute monthly, if possible.

Robert Leonard  08:30

So who is passive real estate investing good for? And who might it not be good for?

Travis Watts  08:38

It all starts with self-education and self-discovery. Who are you? What’s right for you? What are your goals? And what’s going to help you get to those goals? Some people are very hands-on. They like to do their own work as a kind of creative avenue. Maybe fix-and-flips are the right fit for that individual. But you also have to look at the risk and reward. There are other factors besides, “I like working on houses.”

A lot of the investors that do what I do don’t have my story per se. Many are working professionals: engineers, VPs, CEOs, business owners, doctors, dentists, lawyers, attorneys. They’re focused on a professional career that they’re usually good at, and they usually don’t want to quit their job. They’re focused on something else and are making more income than what they’re using, and see that the excess needs to be parked into investment. But a lot of folks don’t want all of their capital inside the stock market due to volatility, market cycles, and things like that. I mean, it may not be great to have a huge lump sum just there. So [real estate investing] could be just another avenue to park some capital; something like $50,000 or $100,000, just to kind of diversify your portfolio.

The other group of folks probably have more of a story like mine, in that they’re looking to achieve enough passive income to exceed their lifestyle expenses. [Real estate investing] could also be a great avenue for it. I know a lot of people do different index funds, bonds, and other things, but, quite frankly, there are better returns to be had in most cases in, specifically, passive real estate.

Robert Leonard  10:21

Do you have to be an accredited investor to invest in all these passive deals that you’re talking about?

Travis Watts  10:27

That’s a great question. For those that aren’t familiar, an accredited investor is basically a high-net-worth and high-income individual. You can qualify through one of two ways: (1) million-dollar net worth excluding any equity in your primary residence, or (2) you’re an individual with a qualifying income of $200,000 per year for the last couple of years and with expectations to do the same in the current year. If you’re married, it’s $300,000.

A lot of the offerings in the syndication space are for accredited investors. It comes down to the sponsor and the deal, specifically, and in which regulation they’re operating under. There’s 506C, which is for accredited investors only. No exceptions. Then there’s 506B, which I would say what majority of folks are doing. They can take a sophisticated investor who is non-accredited but does have the ability to understand the risks involved in what it is they’re exactly investing in, whether they have to use a team of advisors or a family office, or something similar to learn the stuff. But it just depends.

The short answer is no, you don’t have to be accredited. The longer answer is a lot of deals accept accredited only. It takes some networking, I guess, to figure it all out.

Robert Leonard  11:43

Is that how you’re finding your deals? Are you just networking and eventually meeting the syndicators?

Travis Watts  11:47

In my opinion, the best way is through networking. If you’re not comfortable with face-to-face or don’t want to go to local real estate meet-ups or seminars, jump on some online forums, like, say, Bigger Pockets. Start searching for either accredited investor opportunities or non-accredited investor opportunities. You’ll come up with folks that are doing all the above. You can find them in different ways, but due to regulation, you can, generally, only solicit or advertise a 506C, which is accredited-only. That gives that illusion when you’re looking online that all of these [opportunities] are only accredited investor opportunities. You cannot advertise a 506B publicly, so you’ve got to run into these folks somehow. Unless you’re online non-stop, networking is probably the best.

Robert Leonard  12:42

Once you find a sponsor to potentially invest with, how are you vetting them? And how do you know that they’re someone that’s not only trustworthy, but they’re also a talented investor?

Travis Watts  12:52

Yeah, that’s also a great point. This has been a big learning curve. This is kind of the “lessons learned” section of this interview. The first mistake that I made when I started getting into syndications was putting far too much emphasis on a pro forma (projected returns, anticipated what-ifs, maybes down the road, etc.), and a lot less emphasis on the team behind the scenes. What’s their track record? Their experience? Who’s on the team? Have they done this before? How heavy is the lift, meaning the business plan? Are they just slapping some paint on something? Or are they doing gut renovations on all the units?

The short answer to that is my criteria, nowadays, is to look for teams, first; to look at the market, second; and to look at the deal, third. It’s the opposite of what I used to do.

To your point, do you align with these folks? As a value-add investor, do you believe in fixing things up and creating new value in the property? Or are you into new development, brand new construction, and luxury high-end stuff? Everybody’s different. Everybody’s risk tolerance is different.

It’s, again, back to looking inward. What are you all about? What’s your risk tolerance, and why? All that kind of stuff. Then, find groups out there that align with that mission. The one that aligned with myself and my wife was Ashcroft Capital. Now, I’m part of their Investor Relations team. We’ve been investing with Ashcroft, Joe Fairless’s firm, for about four years now, and with nine of their deals currently. The reason was that everything that they do was everything that we put on the paper of what we looked for in a syndication group. When we found that, we just did deal after deal after deal with them. It starts with looking inward.

Robert Leonard  14:41

Once you find the sponsor that you’re willing to invest with, do you just continually invest with them multiple times over and over and over? Or are you diversifying your portfolio across multiple sponsors?

Travis Watts  14:50

I’ve always been a firm believer in diversifying, no matter what we’re talking about. I have a little bit of exposure everywhere. I believe in diversification; geographically, asset class, different teams, and all that kind of stuff. Ashcroft’s just one of the teams that we resonate really well with that we continue investing for many different reasons. But the short answer is we have investments with, around 14 different firms. I started with doing one per team until I could learn who the key players were, and which deals out-performed others. I would go back to those over-performing deals, double down, and do another deal with them. I kind of went into hyper-diversification mode, and now, I’m honing it back into the handful that I really enjoy working with.

Robert Leonard  15:42

Outside of choosing different sponsors, do you diversify your portfolio? Are you choosing different asset types or strategies?

Travis Watts  15:51

Yeah, there’s a great quote, I forget exactly who said it, but when your education goes up, your risk goes down. I understand the asset class, inner workings, and the ins-and-outs a lot more than I did years ago. Because of that, I feel comfortable having about 80% of my portfolio in B-class and C-class value-add multi-family among different sponsors. I consider that being diversified, whereas a lot of folks might argue, “You’re all in real estate. You’re on the same asset type, and that’s not true diversification.” But I do have, as mentioned, some ATM investments, distressed debt, note lending funds, and other kinds of cash flow investments. So I do have some other exposure out there. I’m not tied to one thing. Just understanding the risk and the reward ratios, I think it’s a great place to be even through a recession. That has been my focus for about the last three and a half years: I want recession-resistant asset classes to invest in.

Robert Leonard  16:59

Which markets, specifically, are you currently targeting for your investments?

Travis Watts  17:05

I like to be open-minded. I like to not just say, “I’m only investing in Colorado, and that’s the end of that. I grew up here. I know it, and that’s the only market.” I kind of look at things on a macro scale. For example, migration patterns. Where are people moving from? Where are they moving to? Why? I also look at things like taxes. Texas and Florida are no-income-tax states. A lot of people are moving to Florida from high-tax states like New York and New Jersey. A lot of people are moving to Texas from California. I track that kind of stuff. And, just from a very high level, I kind of make a determination that, for example, right there I like Texas, and I like Florida. Those aren’t the only two markets I’ve invested in and they’re not the only two I’m going to stick with. But they’ve got some great sub-markets and I think some great growth potential too.

Robert Leonard  17:54

I currently live in the New England area. I live in a state with no income tax, which is great, but I still invest long-distance. I do most of my investing in Texas, as well. I definitely understand that market, and I like that market myself.

How much emphasis are you putting on location when you’re looking for deals? I mean, you’re not an active investor, right? You’re not going out saying, “I’m targeting deals in the cities or the states.” You, more or less, have to go where the syndicators have deals. So are you more interested in the deal itself, and then, if the location is good, then you’ll go with it? Or is it, “I’m looking for these specific markets. Once a deal pops up, then I’ll invest there?” How important is the location for you?

Travis Watts  18:39

Number one is the team track record, experience, and philosophy, and the types of deals they do, in general. That’s always number one. Number two is the market. I think that markets can do wonderful things even with a butchered up business plan, even with a brand new group that doesn’t know what they’re doing. If you’re in the right market at the right time, the deal can still come through. That’s happened in my experience.

So, to answer your question, I go macro scale. I just say, “Hey, Texas, in general, maybe not every market, maybe not every little place, but in general, I like it.” If one of my groups comes up with a deal and says, “Okay, we’re doing this deal in Lubbock, Texas.” I don’t know anything about it, so I let them fill me in on their research, and why they think that sub-market is going to do really well. If I resonate with that, agree, and think it makes a lot of logical sense, and it’s got diversified employment, lots of jobs, and so on, then I’ll go along with it.

On the flip side, there are some markets I’ll almost never do a deal in, like Manhattan or San Francisco. It’s just not my type of thing, not to bash on those. There are definitely opportunities to be had, but it doesn’t fit my risk tolerance, my goals, and what I’m looking for.

Robert Leonard  19:55

What are some of the mistakes that you’ve made as an investor? Both as an active investor, so back when you were doing your own deals, and also as a passive investor today.

Travis Watts  20:07

As an active investor, I think I could give you a CVS receipt full of mistakes. I think I didn’t do much right in the active realm. I just wasn’t that good at it. I was going through the motions. Colorado had a great market. That was definitely helping add a cushion even if I made some mistakes. [Thanks to that,] I could just sell the property two years later and make a profit. But the biggest part of that experience was realizing that I shouldn’t have been in the active space. What business did I have managing tenants, collecting rent, being my own little accountant, saving and filing all my receipts, and studying up on what I can write off and what I can’t? There was just so much stuff that, in hindsight, I should have been hiring out for, and I shouldn’t have been doing. A lot of my mistakes were around just being in the wrong strategy.

On the passive side, I basically alluded to earlier. There were a couple of deals I had done early on, in which I wasn’t paying attention to the team or the track record. I was taking these projections at face value and saying, “Hey, this one says I’m gonna make 10% for the next five years. I guess I’ll just sign up for that.” Then a year and a half later, the business plan’s been butchered up, the returns are stopping, and the whole thing’s not working out. Really, it came down to not knowing the team and not knowing their experience level.

Robert Leonard  21:30

So if you could go back and do it again, would you have skipped the active side of your investing? Would you have just saved, saved, saved all your money until you could have invested in passive deals, or would you go through that active piece of it again?

Travis Watts  21:43

That’s a great question. You know what? At the end of the day, if you’re going to be a passive investor, it comes down to having enough investable assets, enough money to make it make sense. You know, I always use this example: If all you have to invest is $25,000, you probably don’t want to be a passive investor, because you’re gonna get around $125 a month cash flow. Big deal; you get to cover your cell phone bill passively. It’s just not that inspiring. I don’t think that would have motivated me to push on and continue.

When you’ve got substantial assets to invest, it makes a lot of sense. When you start saying $1,000 to $4,000 a month, all of a sudden, [you think], “Hey, wait a second. In a couple of years, I could replace my job with this income. I could retire early with this income. This is starting to mean something.” So, I would say, focus first on income, saving and investing; and investing in yourself. Whatever it is you do for money, it doesn’t matter. But focus on that. Get your money right, and then when you have enough, think about passive. Because at the end of the day, how else are you going to retire? Everyone has to go passive anyway. Everyone needs cash flow and income at a certain point. Why not start that process early, and then maybe retire early or something like that with it?

Robert Leonard  23:11

If you could go back and give yourself one piece of advice when you were just getting started, what would that piece of advice be? Or what number one piece of advice would you give to somebody that’s new to investing today?

Travis Watts  23:21

Honestly, I would say start with yourself and look inward. That may sound really basic and obvious, but it’s not. I mean, really, like write this stuff down. Get a couple of books, listen to Tony Robbins. Get inspired. Get motivated. Write down your goals. Where do you want to be in 5 years? 10 years? 20 years? At what age do you want to retire? What do you want to have in life? What does that look like? Do you want to travel more? Do you want a family? Really try to find a model that makes sense for you, and what your goals and ambitions are. At the moment that I finally realized I wanted to retire early, to travel a lot, to not be bogged down, and so on, all of a sudden, syndications came into play. It was like, there’s your solution. But that’s not the solution for everybody. So it’s just about looking inward and soul-searching, I guess.

Robert Leonard  24:14

I know you’re a big proponent of time freedom. Let’s talk about that a little bit. What is time freedom?

Travis Watts  24:21

I’m a huge advocate of time freedom! I don’t know who coined this term, but time freedom, to me, is the ability to do what you want, when you want, and as much as you want with your time. It’s literally freedom over your time. And so when does this occur? And what is that all about? It happens when you have enough truly passive income rolling in, that you didn’t have to do anything for. Whether you had been sitting on your couch or had been vacationing for a month, that money’s coming in no matter what, and that exceeds your lifestyle expenses, your mortgage payment, all your bills, and so on. You now have freedom over your time. Do you want to keep doing the job that you have? Or do you want to quit and pursue something different? Do you want to do more charity work? Do you want to switch to part-time work? Do you want to retire early? It’s endless possibilities. Time freedom, to me, is all about that. This isn’t really a money game. It’s not about hoarding cash. It’s not about buying mansions and Lamborghinis, unless that’s really your thing. Everybody’s different, but it’s about doing what you want to do with your time. That’s what passive income can do for you. That’s what it’s done for me. And that’s why I do it.

Robert Leonard  25:34

I do have to say: I’m a very big car guy myself. I do want a supercar. I don’t care about the mansions, private jet, or anything like that. I’ve always liked cars, so that’s one thing I want. It’s that car and time freedom that I’m looking for, as well. I think a lot of people are.

I’m curious to hear what you mean and how you would define “passive.” The reason is that I get that question a lot from listeners. What is passive? If you have to work on something for a few weeks, months, or maybe even a year to build an asset, but then it’s passive from then on, do you consider that a passive income stream? Or is it something that you just put money into once, like maybe syndication, and then it’s solely passive from there? Where does that line get drawn for a passive income source?

Travis Watts  26:21

Everyone’s definition is going to be a little different. I don’t try to look at things in a black and white sense. As if you cross that line, it’s no longer a passive deal. For example, a business. You can have an active business like you’re running a franchise. You’re working in it, and you’re the boss. But well, it’s obviously not passive, right? Because you’re an employee. You work in it. Or you could buy a franchise, and hire everybody to run it, while you sit at home and do nothing in the business. That’s a passive business.

In stock market investing, it also depends, right? If you’re trading stocks every single day, you’re watching the markets go up and down, and you’re putting in all your buys-and-folds, that’s active. If you buy an S&P 500 Index fund, sit on it for 20 years, then look at it, that’s passive.

It’s really about your time. I don’t know what the right answer is here, but on a passive deal like syndication, I put in x amount of hours upfront, betting the team, betting the deal, making a decision, putting it all together, signing documents, sending a wire, then it turns passive. For 3-10 years, I’m literally not doing anything. I’m just collecting what some people call “mailbox money” or passive income. That’s the type of stuff I’m after. You put in the work once, or maybe never, and then that’s it. It doesn’t require your time.

Robert Leonard  27:45

What do you think is one of the best ways to start generating passive income for somebody that’s just getting started, and might not have a ton of money in to invest? Should they buy vending machines or something along those lines? Or should they put that into a single-family rental, and grow that way? What do you think might be the best way for them?

Travis Watts  28:02

I go back to what I mentioned earlier. If you only have $5,000 to $15,000, I don’t know if passive investing is really a logical choice. I mean, you can go for a REIT (Real Estate Investment Trust); publicly traded on the stock market, some have a share price as low as $5. You can go buy a REIT for $5 and be a passive investor. I’m not a big proponent of the stock market or REITs. But hey, if I had $5, and I wanted to say I was a passive investor or get started, that’s one way.

Also, one of your questions earlier was do you have to be an accredited investor? No, there are some opportunities for non-accredited sophisticated investors to get started at as little as $5,000. There are crowdfunding platforms out there, and different companies doing these non-accredited funds. If you really want a $20 a month passive income, I guess that could be an option for you. But truthfully, though, I would just double down on my knowledge, books, networking, podcast, and my career, my income, even if it’s W2 and I don’t like my job. I’d be trying to crush that and save as much as I could until I have a substantial amount of $100,000. Then I’d think, “Okay, now, maybe I can go passive.”

Robert Leonard  29:16

What are some ways that somebody who’s new could potentially get involved with a syndicator without necessarily investing money, but still get value? Maybe they’re even working for free, but they’re getting involved in learning the business. What are some ways that people can do that?

Travis Watts  29:32

When I hit that FI (financial independence) number, I started pursuing work that was more meaningful to me. Work that I could personally benefit from and grow from as a person. I didn’t have to worry so much about how much I was getting paid, if I was going to get a raise next year, and if there would be a bonus this quarter. None of that was on my mind. What was on my mind was, “I want to know this stuff.”

One of the first things I did was I went to work for a brokerage firm. I wanted to learn stocks, bonds, mutual funds, and REITs. I thought, “Man, if I can crush that and real estate, I’ll have this whole investing thing down.” You know what? I only lasted like nine months doing that. I hated that job, and it didn’t resonate well with me. I was already a real estate investor. I saw the power and the benefits of it. I tried to push these mutual funds that, quite frankly, didn’t make any sense to me. I couldn’t sell that to anybody, so I had to quit. I just resigned from that.

So what I did next, to your point, was I went and worked for a syndication group. They were a newer group. They had an opening. I offered to add value at very low wages, and just said, “Look, I’ll do my best. I’ll do everything I can. Let me help.” The professional background helped, I guess. That’s what led me to Ashcroft Capital. Investor Relations, to me, is not a job. It’s not a W2 job. It’s not a full-time gig. What it is is I get to help other people along their path, and coincidentally, when they coincide with Ashcroft, usually on their own, I’m a point of contact. I can help explain their deals, what it is they do, why, and their philosophy and track record. I can help give back in that type of way, doing what I love, talking about what I talked about, and going to networking events. I already do all of those anyway. It’s just a true win-win.

Robert Leonard  31:15

You just touched on it briefly there, but what exactly does the Director of Investor Relations do for a syndication firm? What does your day to day look like?

Travis Watts  31:25

Wow! There is no day-to-day. There is no schedule. Thankfully, no cubicle, no nine-to-five. I go around, and I attend a lot of live events. If you attend big events nationwide, you’ll probably run into me. I’ll probably be standing behind an Ashcroft Capital booth somewhere. Maybe I’ll be a speaker, or whatever it may be. Literally, I’m just helping answer people’s questions, helping connect people to the right people, to the right avenues, and things like that. I’m not a capital raiser or anything like that. I just,                                    simply, am a helpful resource for folks that want to learn more about what I do.

Robert Leonard  32:06

So what is stopping you from going out and starting your own syndication fund?

Travis Watts  32:13

Knowing myself, knowing that I don’t want to be active, and knowing how much time commitment and effort that takes. Because it’s starting a business, it’s having a job. I mean, however you want to look at it, it takes a tremendous amount of time, effort, and resources to pull off syndication. I know what that takes and I just don’t want to do it. I just like having more of that flexibility and time freedom.

Robert Leonard  32:35

Yeah, I think that’s really the most important component there, right? You probably see it better than anyone else, so you could probably start one pretty successfully. But again, it’s going to take a lot of your time, and it’s going to take a lot of money to do that. Whereas now you have a good thing going. You have a lot of free time. You’re able to do what you want. And so you just weigh the benefits versus the cost and it’s just not worth it at this point in your life, I suppose.

Travis Watts  32:57

Know yourself, as I said earlier. You have to look inward. You have to write this stuff down. You have to understand why. Why do I want to travel? Why do I want to be retired early? Why? Why? Why? You got to answer that stuff. It takes some time. I’m not saying, right now, get out a pen and paper, and get the answers down, and tomorrow, start a whole new life. It takes some soul-searching. It’s evolving all the time, but that’s what I did, and that’s what made all the difference.

Robert Leonard  33:20

Are there any tools or resources or any specific steps that you’d recommend somebody take to start that journaling or self-discovery process that you’re talking about?

Travis Watts  33:32

I’ve always been a huge fan of Anthony Robbins. He has different workbooks, CDs, DVDs, programs, and seminars, and so on. Everybody’s different and how they learn. I started with his box set, Unleash the Power Within. It’s like a 7-disc series. Every 3-4 years, I listen to that series and I’m always taking new stuff away because your life’s always changing, right? New things come up. You live in new areas, you do new jobs, careers, and now you’re seeing it from a new perspective, and you’re getting re-motivated in a different way. It doesn’t have to be Tony. There’s probably 1,000 people out there that teach goal-setting and stuff like that. I think even like the real estate guys, they do a seminar every year specific to goal setting. Probably real estate related. I haven’t been to that event, but that could be another option.

Robert Leonard  34:25

Awesome, Travis. This conversation really has been informative as to how someone can make a transition from active to passive real estate investing, and how to find the best syndication deals to invest in. Where can the audience go to connect with you to learn more?

Travis Watts  34:42

Email’s the best way. My email is travis@ashcroftcapital.com. You can find me at ashcroftcapital.com, as well. I’m on LinkedIn, Facebook, and Bigger Pockets. I’m out there. I’d love to connect with any of your listeners, even if it’s not about Ashcroft or syndications, and it’s just about getting started or house-hacking or whatever. I just like to help where I can. If it’s something I’ve done before, I’m happy to help along the journey.

The last thing I’ll say is that a lot of stuff that we’ve talked about here on this podcast, like betting teams, betting markets, finding deals, passive terminology, I have in my Passive Investor Resource Guide. It’s a free download. It’s a 20-page PDF and goes over all this stuff in a lot more detail. It’s a great resource. Get that at ashcroftcapital.com/passiveinvestor.

Robert Leonard  35:31

I would definitely take Travis up on his offer there. Reach out to him with any questions you have. Give him feedback on the episode. Let him know what you think. Let him know that you heard him here.

I’ll be sure to put links to all of Travis’s resources, the e-book, the PDF file that he just mentioned in the show notes so you guys can go check it out.

Travis, thanks again for your time.

Travis Watts  35:49

Thanks, Robert. Thanks so much!

Robert Leonard  35:51

Alright, guys, that’s all I had for this week’s episode of Real Estate Investing. I’ll see you again next week!

Outro  35:58

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